Equity & Inclusion Suite: Championing Equity For Our Children and Families
Listen to “Equity & Inclusion Suite: Championing Equity For Our Children and Families” on Spreaker.
January 24, 2025
On this episode of Equity & Inclusion Suite, we dive into an inspiring conversation as James Burroughs welcomes Tikki Brown, the Commissioner for the Minnesota Department of Children, Youth, and Families. Listen in as the two converse on Tikki’s background, her journey into human services, and taking on her new role as a Commissioner. James and Tikki explore her remarkable journey into human services, her strategic vision for building a diverse leadership team, and the critical importance of addressing disparities among youth and families in Minnesota.
Transcript
Dr. Kade Goepferd: This is Talking Pediatrics, a clinical podcast by Children’s Minnesota, home to the Kid Experts, where the complex is our every day. Each episode, we bring you intriguing stories and relevant pediatric health care information as we partner with you in the care of your patients. Our guests, data, ideas and practical tips will surprise, challenge, and perhaps change, how you care for kids.
Welcome to Talking Pediatrics. I’m your host Dr. Kade Goepferd. Making sure that each child and family has the unique resources and care they need to reach their full health potential is the definition of health equity. On Equity Actions, Children’s SVP of Government and Community Relations and Chief Equity and Inclusion Officer James Burroughs interviews guests and tackle subjects that help us work toward equitable and inclusive care for all kids.
James Burroughs: Welcome to Talking Pediatrics. I’m your host, James Burroughs, coming to you from the Equity and Inclusion Suite, and today’s guest is a special guest. Tikki Brown is the first commissioner of the new Minnesota Department of Children, Youth and Families. She’s responsible for services and policies that facilitate adoption, foster care, child protection, child support, childcare and early learning, as well as cash and food support and youth justice. She supports Governor Tim Walz and Lieutenant Governor Peggy Flanagan to stand to make Minnesotans the best place for children to grow up while advancing equity inclusion for the children and families that they serve. And we serve in the state of Minnesota now Tikki, can you tell us about your background and what led you to your current role as commissioner?
Tikki Brown: I actually started working in human services as a executive pathway intern 20 plus years ago. So I came into Human Services by happenstance. So I had finished my degree in psychology and was a little bit burnt out from college life and decided to just waitress for a little bit. And one of my regular customers was a human service recruiter, and so they encouraged me to look into the executive pathway internship program at the Department of Human Services, which I then did. And to be honest, I thought, this is not for me, I don’t really see myself in. And so I chalked it up as good experience. But then folks reached out and connected with me after that internship and offered me a position on a brand new program and service that was working with community partners and organizations to improve SNAP access in Minnesota. And that really hooked me into human services.
My childhood background is actually one that we were on SNAP, it was called food stamps back then. And so was able to make a direct link to the experiences that I had as a child growing up on food stamps, to working with communities and county partners across the state to really remove some of the barriers that participants were facing and that people were. And that really got me hooked into human services. And so once I realized that there were things I could do as an individual within a large state system that could improve the lives of people who needed access, needed information about programs needed, ways to just make their lives better, I never looked back. And so 20 plus years later, I have made my way through the ranks. And when this new opportunity opened at the Department of Children, Youth and Families, I thought it was really important that somebody had both lived experience in some of the services and programs, but then also state service understanding to, as we’re building a new department, it’s so important to understand the nuances and the complexities that exist within state government. So as you start to take that apart and put something new together, you sort of know where the boundaries are and where the grey is and where you can move into new and different spaces. So all of that experience I think has prepared me well for this role.
James Burroughs: We’re thankful for that Executive Pathway program because that internship still exists.
Tikki Brown: It sure does. It sure does. I think they use me as an example now of internship to commissioner and I’m always happy to speak to those interns and make it a point to recruit people into it and talk to people. I just think it opens up your eyes into a whole new world I didn’t understand before I entered into state service. The breadth and depth of all that can be done within state agencies and in particular state human services. And it really opened my eyes and gave me a whole new appreciation for bureaucracy, if you will. But the importance of having people that have my experience that look like me, that have differences, I think is really important in making sure that we have a more comprehensive system and voices at the table that can really bring in all of those different experiences so that it doesn’t become just sort of one node and just focused in on different aspects that can be important. But I think that whole picture is really important.
James Burroughs: How has your experience as a child influenced your decision making now?
Tikki Brown: It has made me probably more compassionate in terms of when I think about the experiences that my mother had in utilizing so many different programs, and she shared pretty openly with us the embarrassment she felt, how difficult it was to ask for help, how different people treated her as she needed that help. And I think that has made me incredibly compassionate. As I think about people who are utilizing the services in Minnesota, no one wants to. I think there’s sometimes a misperception that people want to stay on these programs. We do not make it easy for people to get on the programs to utilize them and to stay on them. And so my mother in sharing, I think, her experiences really, it stuck with me and watching her quite honestly in some of the situations where she needed to use the food stamps and people’s reactions in the line, the policing of what she was buying.
So as I spoke to people around the state in that first job and in careers and all of the different positions I’ve had since, I’ve made it a point to connect with people who are utilizing our programs to really understand from them how they’re experiencing it and then what is it that we can do from my position and from a state perspective to utilize the power that we have to make it better. There should be no shame in needing assistance and needing support, and there’s not a failing when people need to utilize programs or assistance. And so I think all of that has really helped me think carefully about bringing in different leaders who have different experiences. I think that’s so important to have those different voices at the table and just to be really open and understanding to what people are going through and to make really our country be able to do all the things that we want it to do to thrive and be strong and successful. We need to help folks when they need it.
James Burroughs: So what are some of your top priorities? What’s the things that you say at the top of your mind every day to make this a great department?
Tikki Brown: So first it’s to finish hiring. My leadership team, we launched on July 1st, and so we are what, 130 something days in? So not incredibly old yet. If we think about children, I’m still in the newborn phase, but certainly filling out my leadership team. And I have been very thoughtful in thinking about how my leadership team can represent all that is Minnesota. So I’m proud of the diverse team that we have built so far. I have a few more to fill out, and so I’m excited about that. And then as we continue to go through a transition, so we started on July 1st and we are technically in a transition welcoming in new employees and new programs all the way until July of 2025. And so my goal in this throughout that timeframe is to ensure that we are making that transition happen very well for all the employees and programs that are coming over and that we are setting up systems in place so that those teams can thrive.
So we still have juvenile justice programs to transfer over in June of 2025, Office of Inspector General licensing and audit functions that will transfer over in June of 2025. And then between now and in June, we have operational functions that are transferring over as well. So a lot of it is setting up the systems and the structure and the organizational aspects of the work so that we are solidified and ready to really launch next July. But in the meantime, we are embarking on a strategic planning process and really connecting with a lot of folks to hear what are their hopes and dreams of the new department, what are some things we can focus on? And so as we launch our strategic planning, we’ll work with community partners and internal staff and people that experience our programs to hear from them, and then we’ll develop our top priorities for the department based on all of that engagement.
James Burroughs: We’re under a mental health crisis for our young people. We are experiencing a high level at Children’s and other places. A lot of times we don’t have enough resource for them, whether it be in doctors, counselors, therapists, or just that person to talk to. So one of the things I want to ask you is do you see that mental health is going to be a chopped challenge to your department? And if so, what are some of the ideas you may have about partnering with community organizations or hospital systems like ours to make it better?
Tikki Brown: As I talked to different folks about the new department and just about our programs and services, children’s mental health is one of the top things that comes up. I’ve heard from parents specifically that have said, we can’t access resources or my children went through a mental health crisis and now that they’re back from it, I don’t have the resources and support to surround them and I don’t know what to do. So there’s a real lacking, I think, of parents feeling like they have the support they need to help support their children and the youth. And then I’ve also heard specifically from childcare providers that have said since the pandemic, they have seen just a massive amount of behavioral issues in their classrooms that they don’t know exactly how to deal with. So I think it’s at every level. It’s at certainly with children themselves as with parents with the caregivers, and we’re seeing it throughout every single aspect of the system.
The other common theme is there’s not enough resources and support out there and people aren’t able to access services, which is incredibly discouraging and harmful. I think what we then see is it pops up in other ways, right? We start to see different behaviors and different ways that the system responds when there isn’t support. So we at the Department of Children, Youth and Families don’t have a children’s mental health program that actually stayed at the Department of Human Services, but we recognize, given how prevalent this is, that we need to ensure that we are working in strong coordination with human services, but also our other partners. So we are in the process of hiring a children’s mental health liaison that really be focused in on what are the services and aspects of our existing work? Can we make sure our we’re linked in to provide that support?
And then what are the gaps that we might be able to also help serve? So that’s one thing we’re doing yesterday, actually visiting the Boys and Girls Club in Minneapolis, and they were telling me about a service that they provide, which is a counseling service to the children that are at the club, also to the staff, and also to the parents, really wonderful. So I think there are some really good models out there. There is no funding for that. They have donors that are funding that right now. And so people are feeling the need, I think as best they can through the strong community organization network and systems that we have in our state. But I think there’s a much needed larger level statewide support that needs to be put in place. I don’t know what the answer is quite yet, but I think in partnership we’ll be able to hopefully help try to raise that up and alleviate. And we know, right, given that it’s so complex and prevalent everywhere, there’s not a single solution. It will take a partnership approach with many people and organizations and people coming together to help solve it.
James Burroughs: One of the other things that I’m curious about is I know that Governor Walz and governor finally, I’ve always talked about one Minnesota and the priority of equity and inclusion. How is that being built into the work that you’re doing for all of our children from different racial backgrounds, sexual orientation, gender identity and disability backgrounds as well? How are you building that into the framework?
Tikki Brown: One of the frameworks that we are putting in place within the Department of Children, Youth and Families as we were building it out during this transition year is a whole family systems framework. So this idea of really breaking down the silos among the different programs and working together and really looking at what families need and recognizing we may not have all of the services within our department, but it is our goal and role to help surround them and bring in those different services so that all their needs are attended to. So that’s one of the frameworks that we’re building in central to that is an equity framework and is being embedded within almost everything we do. In some of my previous roles, I have tried to work really hard to make sure that we embed equity in all of our work so that it just becomes a natural action and effort to what we do.
And so it’s not an afterthought and added in later. And one of the things that we have done is each of our legislative proposals must go through an equity review. And so as they come up through and get approved through leadership, they’re not approved if they don’t have an equity analysis and an understanding of how they might impact or support different aspects of the populations that we’re serving. So I think working on ensuring that we have things like that built in is part of the work that we’re doing over this next year. We also have an equity and engagement office that is working to put in place. They only have two people so far, but they have a few more people that will be hired, but really working to put in place strategies, tools, and definitions in place so that as again, as we do our work, it just is embedded in our work and it’s what we do.
The other important aspect of that is really hearing from people. We know the data, right? We’ve seen the data. We understand pretty much every single program that exists within the Department of Children, Youth and Families has disparities. And we’ve known that for a long time in Minnesota, and there’s been a number of different efforts to try to move the disparities and reduce some of those inequities. And there have been some places where not much has been done. And so one of our efforts is to really move towards action and really address some of the inequities that we see and take what we have heard from community and really put it into action and put it into place. I think communities will tell you they hear many, many times from government where we reach out or ask them what they think about something and then don’t always follow through. And so part of our efforts are also to have a much stronger engagement focus and following up with folks to say, “here’s what we heard, here’s what we’re doing about it.” And then really move towards action.
James Burroughs: How are you going to make sure that the young people who are being impacted have a voice at the table?
Tikki Brown: In some of my positions that I’ve hired, we’ve actually had youth participate the hiring process. So that’s one way of having folks with lived experience or lived expertise as sometimes it’s called, which I actually like better participate in every aspect of our process. We have a number of councils that are in place that have different folks with lived expertise. You participate. What I think we have failed at though, and what we’re working to really dig into more deeply with our equity engagement office is how do their recommendations actually make their way up throughout the agency and into policy and to the awareness of leaders and other people who have the ability to make changes. I think that’s where we, as I look back and think about some of our work in the past, we haven’t done a great job on that. And so really interested in making that link stronger and making sure that those voices, they’re spending a lot of time offering and they have a lot to offer.
And so how do we make sure that that actually is linked more strongly? So I think that’s important. And then we’re also looking at where are there gaps in spaces that we have created that would allow for those voices? And so one of the things that we’re looking at is a parent advisory council and what would that look like? How can we pay people for their time and effort? And beyond that, it’s great to have an advisory council, but you also have to listen and take the recommendations, but then also how can we embed that voice into our policy conversations? We frequently have conversations with folks about our partners of ours, like counties, school districts, tribes. This is a policy that we’re about to implement, what are ways that might impact you? But we rarely reach out to the recipients to ask them about the policy and how that might impact them. So I’m interested in making those pathways easier and more common within the agency, and I think we’ll do that through some extra effort and some extra work, but I think it’ll be worthwhile in the end.
James Burroughs: I’d love to know five years from that when we’re giving out the award to your department and we say that this department has done these three things in order to receive this award and advocating for children, youth, and families, what are those three things that you will have done accomplished in five years?
Tikki Brown: I have this hope that it is a strong agency that is really, truly supportive and uplifting of children, youth and families, right? One that is not easily dismantled. We’ve had that in our history in our state, right? We had a department of children that was dismantled. And some of those lessons I’ve learned from talking to folks who were part of that department when they moved different organizations, agencies over, people did stay in their silos. And so they didn’t work in cooperation or coordination with each other. And so we’re spending a lot of time thinking about the culture and how to break down those barriers using that whole family systems approach and other ways to break that down. So I hope that children, youth, and families of course, are better off, but I hope there’s more funding dedicated to it. And I hope that we actually really, truly make a difference in the lives of children, youth and families.
And I think some of the ways that we could do that is utilizing this cabinet level agency as a catalyst for some of the efforts. So in the juvenile justice space, for example, I’ve heard from a lot of advocates and partners that say there are a lot of people around the state that are doing different things. No one knows what everybody’s doing. People are just on their own island doing the work, really struggling hard just to make it through and meet the needs in their community. And they would love somebody at the state level to bring people together and coordinate services and really put together a roadmap of where Minnesota is going as a state, working on juvenile justice. And so as we get those programs over and get new leadership in place, that’s our goal, is to bring folks together and put together some roadmaps where we can say, as a state, where are we going for juvenile justice?
What are we doing? Is there alignment among our advocates and our partners? So I think one of the awards would be alignment, coordination, roadmap, delivery, implementation. I can go on and on. That’s something we see across the board. Child welfare, same thing where it’s a very complex, complicated system that has done a lot of harm to people, continues to do harm, and despite a lot of people working really, really hard to make improvements. We’ve made some small ones, but we have a long way to go. And so I’m bringing in some additional supports to help us as a state think about where is it that we can go and what are we going to do over the next five years? And so maybe the award is we have achieved our roadmap and we are clear about where we are as a state, what we’re doing, where we’re going, and we’re clear about who we have helped, who we have assisted, who we’ve supported. And some of these systems are working more closely together, are more aligned, and are just doing better, just working better.
James Burroughs: We have a wide variety of audience members. A lot of them are clinicians and people who are working with patients and families directly. If they said to me, well, James, we want to partner and we want to get a part of this work. What can we do? What can you leave them with to say they can get involved and help partner in this work for children and family and youth?
Tikki Brown: The programs that we offer and the services that we provide, a lot of them are really about concrete supports. And so concrete supports, meaning economic assistance programs, cash, food, basic needs, and so many of the humans and families that you are seeing need some aspect of that. Within human services, we always say, if you need food, you likely need housing. If you need housing, you likely need medical support. If you’re in the child welfare system, it’s likely because so many other systems have failed you. And so oftentimes, I’ve heard of some different hospitals and programs offering food assistance. There’s food pantries or ability to ask questions, do you have enough food in your household? And so we have outreach coordinators that partner with community groups that provide services and can connect people to hot food, grocery delivery services. And so I think there are a wealth of resources available if we think about the supports that families need, support that people need, that our agency can help with.
And we’re really interested in partnering with folks too in new and different ways. I think as we think about this new agency and as we have set it up, the goal is to really think about how are we doing things differently? Every single system and support and program offers something. And again, we can’t do it by ourselves. We have to do it together. There’s not enough resources to go around. There’s not enough supports to go around. So if we were to partner together and provide for people and some of the gaps that we see, I think it just makes the state a lot stronger.
James Burroughs: Commissioner Brown, we thank you for coming. Thank you for sharing with us the framework and goals for the Department of Children, Youth and Families, and any way we can partner in the future. We look forward to it. Thank you for coming.
Dr. Kade Goepferd: Thank you for listening to Talking Pediatrics. Come back next time for a new episode with our caregivers and experts in pediatric health. Our showrunner is Cora Nelson. Episodes are produced, engineered and edited by Jake Beaver and Patrick Bixler. Our marketing representatives are Amie Juba and Krithika Devanathan. For information and additional episodes, check us out on your favorite podcast platform or go to childrensmn.org/talkingpediatrics.